Nothing has been posted here for over a year. But, I'll just make one comment. F1 is now a bad joke.
I'm pleased that there are other categories of motorised sport that are still ... a sport. Not perfect, but a sport.
F1 is now a joke
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Mikesbytes
- Posts: 2682
- Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 10:04 am
Re: F1 is now a joke
What do the rules say after rejoining after changing tyres under the safety car?
My signature isn't particularly interesting
Re: F1 is now a joke
Same thing they say if you chose to stay out and hold onto track position.. that when the safety car pulls in you go racing.
The issue at hand is about partial application of letting lapped cars thru. See pg 49&50 of rules link below.
https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... -12-08.pdf
“If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car”
versus
“If the clerk of the course considers track conditions are unsuitable for overtaking the message "OVERTAKING WILL NOT BE PERMITTED" will be sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system.”
The way it unfolded “track conditions” apparently must have been deemed “not safe enough for overtaking” until the wreck was cleared at which time they were declared safe enough for some but not all lapped cars to pass..
So while they sent the message to all competitors, the message was not that all could pass.
Hamilton was a sitting duck on old tires as they gambled the race would end under caution but when the wreck got cleared quicker than thought they lost.
The issue at hand is about partial application of letting lapped cars thru. See pg 49&50 of rules link below.
https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... -12-08.pdf
“If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car”
versus
“If the clerk of the course considers track conditions are unsuitable for overtaking the message "OVERTAKING WILL NOT BE PERMITTED" will be sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system.”
The way it unfolded “track conditions” apparently must have been deemed “not safe enough for overtaking” until the wreck was cleared at which time they were declared safe enough for some but not all lapped cars to pass..
So while they sent the message to all competitors, the message was not that all could pass.
Hamilton was a sitting duck on old tires as they gambled the race would end under caution but when the wreck got cleared quicker than thought they lost.
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Fingernails
- Posts: 1696
- Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:41 pm
Re: F1 is now a joke
Michael Masi has in the past said that the rules state that all lapped cars must be allowed to unlap themselves. Here he simply did the opposite. Claims that he did it because he wanted a green flag lap of racing before the end of the lap. But, he could have done that and there still would have been tension as to whether Max Verstappen would pass the backmarkers and catch Hamilton or not. But, he just went ahead and made up rules as he went along.
The whole thing stinks like a pile of used racing leathers that have been left in a damp pile for three weeks.
No sport is perfect, but what happened is just a joke. Note that I am not a Hamilton fan in particular.
The whole thing stinks like a pile of used racing leathers that have been left in a damp pile for three weeks.
No sport is perfect, but what happened is just a joke. Note that I am not a Hamilton fan in particular.
I do not believe that safety had any part to play in what unfolded.
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Mikesbytes
- Posts: 2682
- Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 10:04 am
Re: F1 is now a joke
Sounds like the protest will not succeed but the rules/procedures may end up changing https://www.crash.net/f1/news/994784/1/ ... -f1-finale
My signature isn't particularly interesting
Re: F1 is now a joke
F1 is over regulated and over controlled. They will make rule changes, but won’t do what should be done and take rules away. Rather they will add more words and more control decision points making it more likely to have situations where rules end up not being followed.
Safety is always used as a crutch to add more regulation and control. MotoGP has been on the same slippery slope now for a few years, but I agree these decisions had nothing to do with safety, my use of quotes with qualifier apparently was to suggest the same.
The first wrong as you pointing out was declaring cars could not pass. Which was unheard of looked like very bad optics from a bias perspective. The second call allowing 5 out of 8 lapped cars thru looked like a make up call. So something that had never been done, followed by something else that had never been done, a new idea imagined by the regulator controlling authority during the race.
I agree with the assessment of it being joke but that the joke was how they got to this point. Motorracing, that which many of us have come to enjoy in various forms, is a non judged event. The stop watch is the truth sayer.
F1 has added layer upon layer to that fundamental notion creating a tangled weave but worse inserting the controlling authority into the middle of it during the race.
Here we had a situation of best drivers in fastest cars take over 3 laps to line up behind each other to then be declared if it is safe to pass or not.
Such are the rules that they require them to drive so slowly under caution, actually dictating a pace as a percent of normal lap times, that they then must follow around the entire track not just the scene of the accident.
So what would otherwise take less that a minute to cue up, took nearly ten. At which time they then wait for instructions.
Following this ridiculous procedure sets the scene. Get rid of that and make reduced pace under cautions observable at the accident is how it has always had been for decades until not that long ago.
As for the racing, the leader in such a situation always has to gamble, knowing whatever you do the other guy is going to do the opposite. Mercedes gambled that this procedure would take longer than 5 laps and when it did not they lost.
Having a predictable standing way thing always happen is the way to go. In the drivers hands not a controller. MotoGP needs to pay attention as they dodged some sketchy calls even just this last year and it will only get more likely to happen with more safety inspired rules and controls being added.
Safety is always used as a crutch to add more regulation and control. MotoGP has been on the same slippery slope now for a few years, but I agree these decisions had nothing to do with safety, my use of quotes with qualifier apparently was to suggest the same.
The first wrong as you pointing out was declaring cars could not pass. Which was unheard of looked like very bad optics from a bias perspective. The second call allowing 5 out of 8 lapped cars thru looked like a make up call. So something that had never been done, followed by something else that had never been done, a new idea imagined by the regulator controlling authority during the race.
I agree with the assessment of it being joke but that the joke was how they got to this point. Motorracing, that which many of us have come to enjoy in various forms, is a non judged event. The stop watch is the truth sayer.
F1 has added layer upon layer to that fundamental notion creating a tangled weave but worse inserting the controlling authority into the middle of it during the race.
Here we had a situation of best drivers in fastest cars take over 3 laps to line up behind each other to then be declared if it is safe to pass or not.
Such are the rules that they require them to drive so slowly under caution, actually dictating a pace as a percent of normal lap times, that they then must follow around the entire track not just the scene of the accident.
So what would otherwise take less that a minute to cue up, took nearly ten. At which time they then wait for instructions.
Following this ridiculous procedure sets the scene. Get rid of that and make reduced pace under cautions observable at the accident is how it has always had been for decades until not that long ago.
As for the racing, the leader in such a situation always has to gamble, knowing whatever you do the other guy is going to do the opposite. Mercedes gambled that this procedure would take longer than 5 laps and when it did not they lost.
Having a predictable standing way thing always happen is the way to go. In the drivers hands not a controller. MotoGP needs to pay attention as they dodged some sketchy calls even just this last year and it will only get more likely to happen with more safety inspired rules and controls being added.
F1 is a joke since 99
Was going to say it has always been a joke.
But no, back in the days of James Hunt, Niki Lauda, Ayrton Senna, "No friends Nigel" and Alain Prost I still watched it.
Mainly to learn about the circuits.
I even went to a formula 1 race. The first at Adelaide in 1985. Saw Lauda race.
Never went to another Formula yawn event after that.
It has been a joke for a long time. I lost interest altogether when Schumacher was winning everything.
Is it time for the Sepang MotoGp test?
But no, back in the days of James Hunt, Niki Lauda, Ayrton Senna, "No friends Nigel" and Alain Prost I still watched it.
Mainly to learn about the circuits.
I even went to a formula 1 race. The first at Adelaide in 1985. Saw Lauda race.
Never went to another Formula yawn event after that.
It has been a joke for a long time. I lost interest altogether when Schumacher was winning everything.
Is it time for the Sepang MotoGp test?
"Faster, faster, until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death," Hunter S Thompson
Re: F1 is a joke since 99
Agreed, F1 really seems like a bad joke since '99.
Yes
According to astrology, my zodiac sign is Cancer. From the Cancer compatibility chart, I learned a lot of useful information about my future couple. The most important thing I understand is that my best match is Pisces.