Ducati V4

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Mikesbytes
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Mikesbytes »

Fingernails wrote:If the Ducati V4 is this competitive in WSBK, will Scott Redding be in with a good basis for a championship challenge in BSBK? Will the fact that they're working on the bike in WSBK and other championships mean that they'll have some transferable knowledge for other series? Or will the different regulations prevent any useful knowledge transfer?
Troy Bayliss decided to race last years twin in ASBK at PI on the weekend sighting insufficient time to set up the new V4 (and probably just as well as he had 2 crashes which would of burnt the maintenance budget if it was the new bikes)

So the answer to your assumption, which is also mine is that it depends on how they go with setup as we know the bike has the plenty of potential
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bikermike
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by bikermike »

Mikesbytes wrote:
Fingernails wrote:If the Ducati V4 is this competitive in WSBK, will Scott Redding be in with a good basis for a championship challenge in BSBK? Will the fact that they're working on the bike in WSBK and other championships mean that they'll have some transferable knowledge for other series? Or will the different regulations prevent any useful knowledge transfer?
Troy Bayliss decided to race last years twin in ASBK at PI on the weekend sighting insufficient time to set up the new V4 (and probably just as well as he had 2 crashes which would of burnt the maintenance budget if it was the new bikes)

So the answer to your assumption, which is also mine is that it depends on how they go with setup as we know the bike has the plenty of potential

What size teams/budgets are they running? Ducati WSBK is big, and I don't think Scott's team in BSB is anything like as big - the info from WSBK may be untranslateable to the smaller teams in BSB/ASBK.

Rick650
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Rick650 »

Bayliss in an interview at PI indicated that they were running the twin because Ducati's V4 development efforts had been focused on the WSBK standard bikes and not the more standard one required for the Australian series. Would the Ducati BSB riders suffer form this as well?

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Fingernails
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Fingernails »

Rick650 wrote:Bayliss in an interview at PI indicated that they were running the twin because Ducati's V4 development efforts had been focused on the WSBK standard bikes and not the more standard one required for the Australian series. Would the Ducati BSB riders suffer form this as well?
They might. On the other hand, BSB doesn't 'start for some while. That may give them extra time to apply the lessons they learn in WSBK to the BSB bikes. And of course, both BSB and ASB may benefit later in the year. If there is actually information sharing, rather than just giving the teams the bikes and letting them get on with it.

bikermike
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by bikermike »

there's a big difference in the budgets and the homolgation rules between WSBK and BSB.

If the WSB boys find the way to do it is bin the current rubbish(!?) forks, replace them with pure unbotanium ohlins super-duper spec and have 3 techs spend 24/7 setting them up, then it's not going to translate to BSB spec as they can't fit the parts or pay the staff to fettle them. If it's a settings issue, then it will percolate down.

The interesting way to find this out will I suspect be the difference between the Kawasaki and the Ducati - whichever is passing down useable info from WSBK will surely do better at BSB.

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Re: Ducati V4

Post by bikermike »

https://www.crash.net/rr/news/914547/1/ ... ucati-v4-r


The v4 will be getting a run-out on the roads. interesting to see how that goes - how will the unobtanium survive a battering over the potholes. (albeit at one of the smoothest roads courses)

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Mikesbytes
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Mikesbytes »

All the local series competitors must be demanding Bautista's setup data. How useful it is will be seen at a guess.

I'm wondering about the E40,000 cap, what can be changed? For example if you are allowed to change the forks then the E40,000 bike can come with forks that were made in China out of crushed fizzy drink cans as they aren't going to be used releasing E's that can be spent elsewhere on the stock bike
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kenup283
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by kenup283 »

The suspension can be changed but for some years now only parts from a price capped approved parts list can be used.

The only impact I've seen recently regarding homologated special suspension has been since last year when electronic suspension was banned just after kawasaki anounced their new bike with it, and now I noticed in ducati for example only offer the electronic suspension on the street bike and not the race homologation bike. So they save some there to offset whatever they are putting into subsidizing the rest of the bike.

Below is a breif excerpt from the WSBK rules and link to the approved parts list spreadsheet for easy reference.

Suspension - General
Participants in the Superbike class must only use the approved and listed suspension units for that season.

The approved products from the manufacturers must be available to all participants at least one month before the first round of the World Superbike season, and remain available all season. The products must be available within 6 weeks of a confirmed order.

Setting parts and tuning parts must be provided by the suspension manufacturers to all customers/ teams/ participants using the manufacturer’s products. These parts can be used by all participants during the season. These parts shall be available for immediate delivery to all teams/customers.

Teams may not modify any part of the forks or shock absorber, all setting parts must be supplied by the Suspension manufacturer and available to all teams/riders.

The suspension manufacturers are allowed to offer service contracts when the team is using the approved and listed suspension products. The suspension manufacturers cannot demand a service contract for a customer or participant in order to obtain a suspension product.

Electronic suspension cannot be used.

Electronic controlled steering damper can only be used if installed on the homologated model for road use. However, it must be completely standard (any mechanical or electronic part must remain as homologated).


http://www.fim-live.com/en/library/down ... o_cache/1/

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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

Let's open the can of worms.

Is it Alvaro or is it the V4R?

:D

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JanBros
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by JanBros »

it's obviously Alvaro, as the 3 other Duc's are only fractionaly faster on the straights.
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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

JanBros wrote:it's obviously Alvaro, as the 3 other Duc's are only fractionaly faster on the straights.
Absolutely, if the bike was that good, the rest of them would be at the front too.

I made a point of watching all 3 races this weekend because I'm always very quick to slag off WSBK.

Bautista looked a class above, he's riding the bike hard, those times and consistency weren't a gift, he earned those wins, but he was so much better.

The racing wasn't really any better than the last time I watched it, but it is just a different face at the front...

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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

48.666 seconds if you add up Bautista's winning margins, it's an absolute demolition job.

What's the deal on rev limits if Bautista keeps this up, but all the other Ducati's continue to struggle? Would be a little disingenuous to punish the other Ducati riders wouldn't it?

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JanBros
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by JanBros »

Tourn46 wrote:48.666 seconds if you add up Bautista's winning margins, it's an absolute demolition job.

What's the deal on rev limits if Bautista keeps this up, but all the other Ducati's continue to struggle? Would be a little disingenuous to punish the other Ducati riders wouldn't it?
nothing, the rules come to work when a bike is dominant, not when a rider is dominant. so unless the other Ducs join the podium regularly, Alvaro will have max rpm's for the whole season.
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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

JanBros wrote: nothing, the rules come to work when a bike is dominant, not when a rider is dominant. so unless the other Ducs join the podium regularly, Alvaro will have max rpm's for the whole season.
That's good to know, I generally don't follow WSBK so I'm not very clued up on this balancing act.

It's more intriguing than the actual races, which I guess isn't a good thing!

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Mikesbytes
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Mikesbytes »

The comment I saw was that Davies back is better and its an issue of not having adapted to the bike (and the team not adapting the bike to him)

It seems to me that the bikes acceleration & top speed more than compensate for the bikes weakness's if you are able to ride around the weakness's which Bautista is
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Fingernails
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Fingernails »

JanBros wrote: nothing, the rules come to work when a bike is dominant, not when a rider is dominant. so unless the other Ducs join the podium regularly, Alvaro will have max rpm's for the whole season.
I don't understand the rules either.

It does seem very complicated.

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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

Ducati revs cut by 250, Honda increased by 500.

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Re: Ducati V4 different story in BSB

Post by Apical »

Scott Redding had a decent result in race 1, not so hot in race two.

Mixed results for the Ducatis at Silverstone. Two ducs in the top five in race 1. A fourth in race two, then the next Ducati was way down in 16th.
Tommy Bridewell 3rd in the championship on the Oxford Products Moto Rapido Ducati.

Good mix of manufacturers at the front.
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Mikesbytes
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Mikesbytes »

I'm seeing a pattern, while the Duc V4 is good, its Bautista that's making it look like the bike to kill for , though I suspect as the season goes on we will see the Duc V4 riders going better and better in the various national series

I understand that Bayliss is going to develop the V4 back in Aus while Mike Jones rides his V2 for the Aussie championship
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Tourn46
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Tourn46 »

Mikesbytes wrote:
I understand that Bayliss is going to develop the V4 back in Aus while Mike Jones rides his V2 for the Aussie championship
Develop what? I don't understand what you mean... Is he riding for the Ducati factory in some capacity?

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Mikesbytes
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Re: Ducati V4

Post by Mikesbytes »

Tourn46 wrote:
Mikesbytes wrote:
I understand that Bayliss is going to develop the V4 back in Aus while Mike Jones rides his V2 for the Aussie championship
Develop what? I don't understand what you mean... Is he riding for the Ducati factory in some capacity?
I don't have good info on this, I think the term "develop" that was used is more along the lines of setup. He did say he will race sometime this season and as Mike Jones is riding his V2, I'm assuming that he'll be on the V4. We shall see. BTW the next race is on Sunday
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