2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Discussion and debate about the MotoGP class
Dayle88
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Dayle88 »

It's not like it's some big conspiracy that can't be checked. Just go back and watch sessions from the last five races. I don't think I have them recorded any more but it's not like Rossi and Vinales fly in formation every session.

One of the great things off the track this year is Lorenzo's refusal to accept that Rossi can be faster than him. Taken with a pinch of salt, bearing in mind the type of character Lorenzo is, the comments are hilarious. You only have to look at Lorenzo's face in places like Argentina when he thought he'd beaten Rossi in qualifying until he saw he hadn't and his entire expression and posture changed instantly.

Fred Gassit
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Fred Gassit »

Japhrodisiac wrote:Marquez said the same thing, that VR and MV are giving each other tows regularly. Not sure if I agree but these things will always get painted as JLo is a whiner, and Marc saying the same thing, silence. Just saying...
I think the front page write up covered it well. If two riders can tolerate each other, then they'll be happy to share the circuit/follow/lead the other guy. If they don't like the other guy, the lap will be aborted and a pause for clear track away from the other guy.

Vinales and Rossi always follow the "late to leave "strategy. The fact that they don't get in each others way and happen to circulate or ride in a similar manner is going to lead one getting a tow from the other at some point.

Marquez did say that, but he also said at the end of the day each rider chooses their own strategy, ie when you choose to leave the pit to do your run.

Lorenzo chooses to try and circulate on his own to do his times. Good for him, I have not a negative thing to say about that. When it works for him the bonus is his pace for the race is metronomic.

The negative thing is when he has a bad weekend, or a bad point in a weekend, it's because life is unfair/somebody else's fault.

Marquez says what he thinks, as a statement, that always has the implied disclaimer of "but meh.....who cares, I do my own thing/my own race."


What Dale has said about Lorenzo above this comment is true. When things don't pan out as he had planned/expected.......well, I (personally) find him to be rather uncomfortable to listen to.

As an aside, he seemed to find it funny/take delight when Rossi was upset about the whole Lorenzo/Marquez supposed conspiracy.

To be trivial about what is a triviality, what's that thing about Karma being a bitch ?...... ;)


And as an aside, Lorenzo being the type of personality he is, I wonder what he's thinking about Ducati after watching their season so far ? Barring Iannones' brain fart and the unlucky Dovi at COTA, it's been front, front, front when the bike is pushed to Honda- Yamaha and (sometimes ) Suzuki pace, as well as similar (but nowhere near as bad) drive/acceleration issues as the Honda.

Second thoughts ? Questioning the decision ?

Probably not. No doubt, really, that he'll make a good fist of it there.

........but maybe.... ;)

hdot
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by hdot »

I think people are confusing Lorenzo's lack of grace with him being a sore loser. For example in his Q2 post briefing today he acknowledged he wasn't fast enough, and other riders were able to do better with the tires and conditions. No whining, just statement of fact. Sometimes he can be a bit of a sore loser but it's not all the time. As for his reaction to realizing he got beat for pole... is any rider happy to get beat for pole? Especially after riding a perfect lap with a good feeling on the bike? Seems like folks are using a different yardstick to judge Lorenzo's behavior.

hdot
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by hdot »

As for the race.... I can't wait. 5-6 riders with decent pace and a decent amount of room and opportunity for passing. Should be a good one.

Dayle88
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Dayle88 »

Losing pole isn't really what I was referring to with Lorenzo's view of himself against Rossi though. That is a different thing entirely to what I was talking about.

Japhrodisiac
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Japhrodisiac »

The race is set to be a barn burner though, looking forward to 5-6 riders battling it out the whole way, hopefully

hdot
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by hdot »

Dayle88 wrote:Losing pole isn't really what I was referring to with Lorenzo's view of himself against Rossi though. That is a different thing entirely to what I was talking about.
What exactly are you talking about then.... I just watched it... Lorenzo almost rode past parc ferme at Argentina Q2 because he didn't even think he'd made the front row. And in the interview he was pretty neutral and accepting of his part in his qualifying. Nothing indicating any reaction to Rossi beating him. I think you are seeing things that aren't really there.

Fred Gassit
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Fred Gassit »

I think he's referring to the "conspiracy theory" in regards to the tow (sure made him chuckle when the supposed shoe was on the other foot ), and "I would have won if it wasn't for tyres spinning up, helmet linings, wrong knee sliders" etc.

Doesn't affect me one way or another, two undeniable facts about Lorenzo though.

1. Demonstrably fast on a GP motorcycle.

2. Bit of a weirdo.

Works really hard to come across well in interviews/press conferences....usually does it with aplomb. When he's not happy, the mask slips and it's good old Jorge the 250 rider.

For me, when he's doing well, it's great to watch. When something doesn't go the way he planned/hoped/expected........jeez........he does a pretty good Biaggi impersonation. I've got teenage kids, if I want to hear that kind of behaviour I only have to walk into the next room. ;) :lol:

Bores me to hear it from one of the greatest motorcycle racers on the planet, earning good money to do what he loves doing.

Whoever said it above, yeah....lack of grace/maturity at certain times.

On another note, Iannone ( at this race, and all that a home GP entails) is certainly making a case for Ducati having made the wrong decision. Race-day will be the acid test for his pace over Dovi though. From the press releases, seems he has been riding well outside of the comfort zone though ( by his own words).

L34
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by L34 »

What a fantastic circuit, one day would love to get there.

The Yamaha, Honda and Suzuki seem to have almost the same top speeds and was surprised that Marquez had the fastest final sector time. (The Ducati is a bloody missile.)
Anyone know what gear they take that final bend? Would of thought the Honda might have been one of the slower bikes through that sector.


Looking forward to the race......If the TV director doesn't stuff around like they did in qualifying, changing views from the crowd to the pit crew to the crowd (again) and then back to
another rider for about 10 seconds then go through the whole scenario again. Drove me mad!!!

Fred Gassit
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Fred Gassit »

L34 wrote:What a fantastic circuit, one day would love to get there.
Yeah. :D That, Assen and P.I. :D Wished they still did Suzuka and the proper Hockenhiem. Man...... Hockenhiem full. That'd be a Duc track for sure ! ;) :lol:

Lorenzo, blown engine. woah. :shock: Plenty left, but first blow up from anyone in a while........... Wonder if it will prompt an engine change on the other side of the garage ?

Dayle88
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Dayle88 »

hdot wrote:
Dayle88 wrote:Losing pole isn't really what I was referring to with Lorenzo's view of himself against Rossi though. That is a different thing entirely to what I was talking about.
What exactly are you talking about then.... I just watched it... Lorenzo almost rode past parc ferme at Argentina Q2 because he didn't even think he'd made the front row. And in the interview he was pretty neutral and accepting of his part in his qualifying. Nothing indicating any reaction to Rossi beating him. I think you are seeing things that aren't really there.
I was just trying to give an example, there's a chance I mistook what race it happened at.

atropos
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by atropos »

My goodness! What a finish!

hdot
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by hdot »

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Dayle88
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Dayle88 »

Great finish.

Normally don't say it but that was Rossi's. Spoiled the championship for the moment too.

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CLX
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by CLX »

Stupid RC213V wheelies...

-----
Everything we consider fiction is reality somewhere else. This is somewhere's fiction.

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Tourn46
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Tourn46 »

Amazing rides by the first 2, but gutted for Rossi... He looked really good until the M1 popped :(

Japhrodisiac
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Japhrodisiac »

Really unfortunate for Rossi, he looked like he has Jorge's number today. 2 Yamaha engine blowups today, one for Jorge in warmup and Rossi's in the race

mehow
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by mehow »

Fred Gassit wrote:
L34 wrote:What a fantastic circuit, one day would love to get there.
Lorenzo, blown engine. woah. :shock: Plenty left, but first blow up from anyone in a while........... Wonder if it will prompt an engine change on the other side of the garage ?
If they did change the engine for Rossi as well, could they go back to the used engine in practice in the next race? If that's the case I don't see why they wouldn't swap it as well, until Yamaha understands why Lorenzo's engine failed maybe it shouldn't be treated as an anomaly... Or is it the case that once an engine is changed it stays in until the next one in sequence?

Japhrodisiac
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Japhrodisiac »

How great is Moto3 btw this season? 15 riders covered by 1 second on the 10th lap, a different leader every corner. Amazing show

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Wolfman
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Wolfman »

At the end of lap 4, Iannone was 4.480s from Lorenzo, he finish the race 4.742s, he did the fastest lap 1´47.687 on the last lap of the race (23 laps), the Desmo is a winner, but their riders don´t enjoy that motorcycle, If it wasn´t a Rossi victory, Iannone could win this one.

I´m positive that Lorenzo is going to win a lot of races next year.

I´m down that Rossi couldn´t make it, next time. :(

Japhrodisiac
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Japhrodisiac »

Wolfman wrote:At the end of lap 4, Iannone was 4.480s from Lorenzo, he finish the race 4.742s, he did the fastest lap 1´47.687 on the last lap of the race (23 laps), the Desmo is a winner, but their riders don´t enjoy that motorcycle, If it wasn´t a Rossi victory, Iannone could win this one.

I´m positive that Lorenzo is going to win a lot of races next year.

I´m down that Rossi couldn´t make it, next time. :(
Agree, I think Lorenzo on the '17 Ducati will be a force. Might take a few races to get his setup dialled in but I think he will win 4-5 races on on it and be a championship contender. His smooth style and that motor will be a hard combination to pass

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Wolfman
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Wolfman »

Japhrodisiac wrote: Agree, I think Lorenzo on the '17 Ducati will be a force. Might take a few races to get his setup dialled in but I think he will win 4-5 races on on it and be a championship contender. His smooth style and that motor will be a hard combination to pass
Unlike his future team-mate Dovi, that´s the neck problem, and today he´s got arm-pump, c´mon.

Ducati-Lorenzo-2017 is like the force awakens :shock:

Japhrodisiac
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Japhrodisiac »

Iannone has more outright speed than Dovi but he should have won a race already, or at least been more consistent. Ducati needs a guy that will finish and add to the manufacturer's points tally and not take out his teammate. That's Dovi

hdot
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by hdot »

It's probably too early to say anything, and Mugello is Ducati's home track, but I think Iannone showed a lot of maturity and progress today. I still think Ducati made the right decision, but they are definitely losing a big talent. And now that it looks like Michelin is getting stuff dialed in I expect that we will see more consistency and maybe even a victory from Iannone. If it was going to happen anywhere though it would have been here.

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Squidpuppet
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Re: 2016 Mugello Gran Premio d'Italia TIM

Post by Squidpuppet »

Does Suzuki really need more power???????????????

Maverick's top speeds were better than Jorge's BEST top speed 21 times. :shock:


Ducati = 220.5 MPH :o

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